"viscerl" (viscerl)
02/25/2014 at 18:25 • Filed to: None
2
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"viscerl" (viscerl)
02/25/2014 at 18:25 • Filed to: None | 2
| 56 |
Contention: For any dollar amount that you can dedicate to your automobiles, a combination of multiple vehicles that fit within that budget will always win over a single car. If you live somewhere like NYC where your parking is a giant issue and owning two is almost impossible, you don't love cars enough and should move.
From $5,000: a 95 Miata and a 92 Ford 4wd Truck.
to $200,000: a GT-R/ZR-1/Viper and an E63 Wagon.
For any practical given dollar amount, there are always two+ cars that would generate more hoon happiness than a single car. You can always have an unreliable/2-door/RWD/manual tranny/summer-only-tires/track-happy car AND a family/friends/slushbox/foul-weather/tow-vehicle.
If Chump-car has shown me anything (other than that stock V-8s always overheat and your best friends are terrible drivers), its that you can have a sh*t-ton of fun with a cheap-but-impractical car if you have a cheap-but-practical car to use other times.
...AND that some of the best times I ever had on a twisty road were in worn-out manual RWD crap-cans.
Prove me wrong...
TheBaron2112
> viscerl
02/25/2014 at 18:27 |
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*If you love cars and have the means and space for two, you're doing it wrong.
If you love cars and can only afford to keep up one, you're totes cool.
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viscerl
> TheBaron2112
02/25/2014 at 18:29 |
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If you're driving the same distance using two cars, the upkeep is nominally the same for two vs. one. Space? There's always space if you're creative and don't live "downtown".
redlined94
> viscerl
02/25/2014 at 18:33 |
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Having a few fixer-uppers >>>> one beige daily driver
KirkyV
> viscerl
02/25/2014 at 18:33 |
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I'm British. Space is expensive here.
deadpedal
> viscerl
02/25/2014 at 18:34 |
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Concur.
Although the lower the price, the harder it is. Ask me how I know.
Currently 3 arrows in the quiver. My special lady and I carpool usually, so there are almost always 2 left in the barn. Acts as a home burglary deterrent I imagine...
Also, if you live in NYC or similar...short of Hong Kong, you can keep a vehicle in the outer boroughs.
beardsbynelly - Rikerbeard
> viscerl
02/25/2014 at 18:34 |
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need a reliable DD to get to work that is good on fuel? - MR2 Turbo
Need something quick for track days that can chop skylines and wrx's? - MR2 Turbo
Want something fun for a rally around your mates farm?
Damn. uh.
MyCarDrivesMe
> viscerl
02/25/2014 at 18:37 |
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So you're disregarding the increased insurance of two cars too? And I'm guessing you've never had to deal with commuting in heavy city traffic if you think I should just "move." I live in the city because that's where my job is even if I only have 1 parking spot. I'd rather go somewhere fun on the weekends in my car than sit in traffic for 90 minutes a day going 15-20 mph in it. While I love my car, I love driving it, not sitting in it working the clutch in first gear in traffic.
If your situation allows it and you have the means for it, get two cars. Hell get more, why stop at 2? But sacrificing too much to have multiple vehicles doesn't mean you're a car enthusiast, it means you're not intelligent.
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viscerl
> KirkyV
02/25/2014 at 18:37 |
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My brother lets me store a car in his backyard... I believe that would be your brother's "garden". I bet you have a relative with a spare GER-ahj. ;)
ZHP Sparky, the 5th
> viscerl
02/25/2014 at 18:37 |
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Agreed.
I own 2 wonderful cars that combined cost less than what most of my friends drive, and bring me far more pleasure.
89 BMW E30 for weekend drives, auto-x and the rare track days without fear of breaking the bank
05 Subaru Legacy GT wagon for general driving around, road trips, camping, and getting to the snow.
If I had $20k instead of these two cars and had to find myself wheels I'd buy the same 2 cars all over again.
N/A POWAAAHH
> viscerl
02/25/2014 at 18:38 |
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Well, depends. If you can get a manual, fairly lightweight, MT, that can also be a DD, I think that covers it. It's fun, but also has a fairly good day to day usability.
wkiernan
> viscerl
02/25/2014 at 18:38 |
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Also, if you have two cars you can do your own minor repairs and maintenance and still be reasonably sure you can make it to work in the morning.
I think most opponauts know what I mean. There you are doing some pretty simple job like, for example, changing your brake pads, and just as you're putting it all back together, you tighten down a brake bleed screw and it snaps right off. No problem! You can get a replacement down at the auto parts store for pocket change. The auto parts store that closed fifteen minutes ago.
TheD0k_2many toys 2little time
> viscerl
02/25/2014 at 18:39 |
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I concur. Except i have three so ha!
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viscerl
> beardsbynelly - Rikerbeard
02/25/2014 at 18:41 |
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You need a cheap almost-worn-out 4-door 4wd for ferrying your mates to the match, hooning on farms, and towing your MR2 to the track on better rubber.
Someone Else's Projects
> beardsbynelly - Rikerbeard
02/25/2014 at 18:42 |
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I've rallycrossed a Mk2 MR2 in a farmer's field. You'll be fine. Underbody plastics not so much, but you've already ripped those off, right?
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viscerl
> deadpedal
02/25/2014 at 18:42 |
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Finding a way to carpool with your significant-other magically saves gas and wear-and-tear money for projects and tires. MAGIC! Also allows you to cook along in the carpool lane.
Manuél Ferrari
> viscerl
02/25/2014 at 18:43 |
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Agree, as long as you have the space. I never had more than one space until last year when I moved. I lived by the beach and had one spot. Having a multi-car garage now is like living on a different planet.
Niquemarshall
> viscerl
02/25/2014 at 18:47 |
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Well I've got two as well (R53 Mini Cooper and W201 190e) but about an hour ago, the 190e shredded the belt and I had to take the bus home. Usually when I drive the 190e I end up walking to wherever I'm headed.
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viscerl
> MyCarDrivesMe
02/25/2014 at 18:48 |
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SO what have you done with your one parking spot? When someone walks by it, do they go "That person loves cars."?
I do drive in heavy traffic every day, but I have an awesome seperate car for that.
Big Bubba Ray
> viscerl
02/25/2014 at 18:50 |
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I don't know if I agree with you on this one. I own two cars, but damn does it put a hurt on my wallet, and I still live at home with my parents! Cars are expensive and two of them are even more expensive. You have to take into account garage/driveway space, insurance, gas, parts, tires, and all kinds of other things.
I understand your point being that if you can afford one decent car you can afford two cars of lesser, combined value, but some people who are car enthusiasts may only have the means for one car. What's wrong with pouring your money into one car that you really love, rather than put money into two or more possible crap cans?
I definitely don't believe that a car enthusiast who only owns one car is "doing it wrong." Its a bit condescending to say their passion basically isn't legitimate because they don't have multiple cars.
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viscerl
> ZHP Sparky, the 5th
02/25/2014 at 18:51 |
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You are #winning. I need to buy an E30 so that I can try out owning one. I have had a 2002tii and an E46... but I've never tried an E30. The newer BMWs don't do it for me.
XJDano
> viscerl
02/25/2014 at 18:51 |
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I have 4 + a motorcycle, only 1 car runs.
WINNING!
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MyCarDrivesMe
> viscerl
02/25/2014 at 18:54 |
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Considering I need something that can be reliable and drive me to client sites 3 or 4 days out of the week? Focus ST on the way, I'd say that's a pretty reasonable choice for someone who can only have one car.
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viscerl
> Big Bubba Ray
02/25/2014 at 18:55 |
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Its meant to sound a little pretentious. I see loads of kids these days working harder and harder for the one, new, single bad-ass car, and I don't think they realize that cheaper cars can be just as much fun.
If all someone wants is a good-looking, always running, under warrantee, sort-of-exciting car, buy a G35. But they arent head-over-heels in love with cars.
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KirkyV
> viscerl
02/25/2014 at 18:55 |
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Sadly, I do not. If I did, I'd own a 205 GTi by now. I'm sure there are a fair few British people with that kind of space, but not nearly as many as there are where you live. Our entire country could fit into Texas - just to cite an example; I'm not sure where you are - five and a half times over, and yet we have roughly three times the population.
That's a - really old - picture of my car in my front garden. I have to share that driveway with my sister and, occasionally, mother, and so will generally park out on the street:
As for my back garden... You could barely fit a bicycle, much less a car.
Thankfully, though, there are plenty of automotive options out there that could satisfy both my need for something practical and reliable to drive everyday, and my desperate want for something more:
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viscerl
> wkiernan
02/25/2014 at 18:57 |
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I think this is important. Often the cheaper a car is, the more possible it is to do your own maintenance on it. And while its a pain in the ass at the time, there's something wonderful about a well running car that you (and only you) maintain. And if you love cars, this is a great feeling. Thats not as easy on a brand new BMW/GTR/Corvette/AMG/whatever.
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beardsbynelly - Rikerbeard
> Someone Else's Projects
02/25/2014 at 18:57 |
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I'd have to raise her back to stock height, I've only got ~100mm's of clearance under the rear muffler.
tromoly
> TheBaron2112
02/25/2014 at 18:59 |
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If you own one car and compromise between street driving and track driving, you're doing it wrong.
If you own two cars with one set up for road racing and the other for general street driving (i.e. actually comfortable to drive on the road), you're doing it better.
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viscerl
> MyCarDrivesMe
02/25/2014 at 19:00 |
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I think you've found a compelling argument for 1 car in the city. The ST might just be it.
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viscerl
> Niquemarshall
02/25/2014 at 19:01 |
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And thats the perfect reason to have the Mini.
Mathias Rios
> viscerl
02/25/2014 at 19:06 |
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I like you, have my reliable DD 4Matic ML320, and then my unreasonable crappy project car, 1982 Porsche 924. I think it will be a nice combo when I get the 924 drivable :)
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viscerl
> beardsbynelly - Rikerbeard
02/25/2014 at 19:08 |
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You don't HAVE to..........
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deadpedal
> viscerl
02/25/2014 at 19:10 |
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All true.
Having a few vehicles gives you a flexibility that can't be understated.
All of mine are suitable for daily duty unless we get snow then one is off limits. If one needs brakes...I can wait a bit if need be. Raining? Semi-balds on one of them, take another.
Plus, what car we taking today?.....hmmm....I feel like....
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viscerl
> Mathias Rios
02/25/2014 at 19:11 |
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Nice! Be careful though or the ML will start sapping your 924 funds :)
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ZHP Sparky, the 5th
> viscerl
02/25/2014 at 19:11 |
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Why would you give up a 2002tii?!?! I'm curious about owning a E46 M3 as well, but nothing newer than that excites me....maaaybe a nice 1 series if I can find the right one.
Is the 911 in the picture yours? I'd love to have one of those someday...there's a long list of "older" cars I'd love to have, but realistically I don't think I'll be able to keep more than 1 at a time. Also on the list - 70's Alfa Romeo GTV.
ScapeGoat-Racing
> viscerl
02/25/2014 at 19:17 |
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2 Cars? Bugger; I knew I was doing it wrong. Is 5 excessive? If it helps only 3 of them move (4 if you count the one on the trailer!). I think I misunderstood the "one car, many uses" idea; "many cars, one use" maybe?
Daily driver: '90 Audi 100 Avant Quattro Turbo - handy for moving 5 people, plus luggage (or a wardrobe) in velour-trimmed comfort sideways across a field
Economical car: '97 Fiat Cinquecento - bought for £300 as a runabout when the Audi disagreed with a hedge; uses half the fuel, but much less than half the fun. It's on ebay if anyone wants it! - 'Knight Rider' flash useful for finding it in car parks ...
Project car #1; Euro touring car replica: '84 Audi Coupe - currently taking up half my parents garage. 2 front subframes, neither attached. Also awaiting 10v turbo engine transplant.
Project car #2: Jap GT\drift car: '90 Nissan 300ZX Z31 NA. 3l V6, RWD, pop-up headlights, targa roof; what more could you want? proof that ebay & sleep deprivation aren't always a great combination. I might have to admit I don't have time to finish this, and that the VG30DETT isn't getting installed anytime soon; plus ...
Rocket-ship: '01 TVR Tuscan - Insane, lairy fun. Also the reason I have no money, but once the oil's warm you just don't care. Plus it annoys Porsches like nothing else.
It also helps to have understanding parents who don't mind ... wait, who tolerate, having old cars dismantled on their property! I'm in real trouble when they move though.
Makoyouidiot
> viscerl
02/25/2014 at 19:23 |
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Old Disco to the rescue!
The WB
> viscerl
02/25/2014 at 19:25 |
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I have an '83 Porsche 911 SC I got for $5k. Leaks oil, and pulls under braking
I also have a '67 Mustang with faded paint and pukes tranmission fluid everywhere and scrapes over nickels (long tube headers, it's not slammed)
And an '08 Ranger Sport soon to be replaced with a Focus ST.
All together, worth less than 30k. But So. Much. Fun. If I want to wear orange glasses and speak in an accent while driving on the highway, blast Lynyrd Skynyrd while going from red light to red light, or drive through feet of mud with impunity, I can do all of the above. In the same day!
Übel
> viscerl
02/25/2014 at 19:52 |
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Quality > Quantity. Just sayin'
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MyCarDrivesMe
> viscerl
02/25/2014 at 20:04 |
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Thank you, I know 2 cars is more fun but when your employer give you an allowance for a new car and it's impractical or impossible to have 2 places to keep a car, you don't have to settle for a prius.
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Mathias Rios
> viscerl
02/25/2014 at 20:42 |
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Thankfully, my ML is at 213,000 miles and is incredibly reliable, of course with proper maintenance and upkeep.
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Mathias Rios
> viscerl
02/25/2014 at 20:42 |
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But on an 18 year old's budget, those funds in general aren't very big. :(
GRawesome
> viscerl
02/25/2014 at 21:33 |
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This is what I tell my wife, she fell for it the first 2 times... Now we are at 5 cars, not sure it will work again.
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viscerl
> GRawesome
02/25/2014 at 22:08 |
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You've got 5 cars. So what if she leaves? :D WIN.
cody
> viscerl
02/25/2014 at 23:28 |
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I approve these vehicular choices.
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viscerl
> Übel
02/25/2014 at 23:57 |
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That's not what she said.
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viscerl
> ScapeGoat-Racing
02/25/2014 at 23:59 |
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There probably is some rule about "If 50% of your cars don't run, you arent doing it right", but TVR.
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viscerl
> N/A POWAAAHH
02/26/2014 at 00:03 |
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I dunno... A true "daily driver" makes a lot of compromises. MT in horrendous traffic, rear wheel drive in the winter, lowered and stiff suspension when taking a cute girl out for a first date...
Gotta have at least two.
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viscerl
> ZHP Sparky, the 5th
02/26/2014 at 00:08 |
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I gave up the 2002tii because I turned it into an SCCA ITC racecar and ruined it :( I didnt like the e46 330ix because it was too white-coat vanilla refined.
The 911 isnt mine... its a picture I found on the web. I have a '12 E63 wagon, an '08 Z06, a 98 Volvo S70 T5, and a '10 Toyota Tundra. And I have a garage in the city that holds one car (the e63) while I store the Z06 in my brother's garage (1/2 a mile away, he doesnt use it) and the Volvo and Tundra sit on street parking.
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viscerl
> KirkyV
02/26/2014 at 00:14 |
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As a long time British citizen and many-time visitor, I have always envied cars we don't get over here in the states. A 205GTi is one of them, though I cant imagine owning anything French made. I grew up spotting cars in the UK like a birder spots rare species in flight.
I guess if I lived in the UK and needed to choose, I'd look for a Focus RS. It does snow on rare occasion in Guilford (where Im originally from), but I'd probably just walk to the train station if there was snow everywhere (or stay home).
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N/A POWAAAHH
> viscerl
02/26/2014 at 00:17 |
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I DD MT in stop and go almost everyday, although I drive Awd instead of Rwd, and my car is fairly low and my gf complains but she understands.
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viscerl
> cody
02/26/2014 at 00:30 |
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These arent mine, but I thought he was a good example of someone who gets it :)
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viscerl
> redlined94
02/26/2014 at 00:32 |
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Always.
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KirkyV
> viscerl
02/26/2014 at 00:41 |
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From what I understand at least, you can use a Focus RS in the snow about as well as you can use any other FWD car, provided you're a little cautious with the far right pedal. It'd be perfectly manageable. We didn't have any snow here last year, but for a couple before that it came like clockwork. Honestly, though, the Focus is a little big for me. I like my hot hatches light and tiny.
As for French cars, I'd have to caution you against taking their rather poor reputation for reliability all that seriously. This is purely anecdotal, of course, but my little Pug has been perfectly reliable for the entire time that I've had it, and incredibly cheap to run to boot. And from what I understand, the 205 GTi in particular is far more reliable than any eighties hot hatch really has a right to be. (Though, honestly, I'm actually a little more tempted by the hot version of my own car, the 106 GTi.) It's the more modern Peugeots - essentially anything from 2004-onwards - that you've really got to watch out for. Of course, this isn't really a problem per se, as pretty much every car Peugeot's made since 2004 - with the occasional exception here and there, particularly among their most recent offerings - has been utterly undesirable in pretty much every way, and just generally crap besides.
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GRawesome
> viscerl
02/26/2014 at 09:12 |
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Very unlikely, but if she does hopefully she doesn't get two and a half of the cars. It would be a shame to chop hers in half!
Are those your 2 cars in the picture?
Also, I agree with your thinking. I don't understand people that say they are "car people" but live in NYC and don't own a car. If you were really that into it, you would find a way to make it happen. Plus, every time we go up there all the cars we see are dented, smashed, and filthy. It's vehicular abuse! Get sarah mclaughlin on the phone, have her make a commercial about that.
JEM
> viscerl
02/26/2014 at 11:09 |
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I've had a 2002tii as well as an E21 323i but still never had an E30 either. I'm thinking maybe I should just skip over to an E36? E30's in decent shape seem to be getting pretty damn rare around here in New England. I barely see any on the road anymore.
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ZHP Sparky, the 5th
> viscerl
02/26/2014 at 11:11 |
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Kudos to you, Sir! Juggling 4 cars and city life is no easy task - good job not giving up and going full-on beige!